Category talk:Level Design

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Revision as of 13:47, 4 September 2007 by Kal Esh (talk | contribs) (Proposed Changes)
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This is very interesting, but I can't find any contact info to get permission and it is probably needs an update too. Can anyone help? --Tom Edwards 06:11, 29 Jun 2005 (PDT)

Checking the forums will probably yield something ^Ben
I have uploaded all the entitys images in a nice easy to use gallery http://ben.shadow-phoenix.com/quickgallery/ User:^Ben


It would be really cool if someone could contact the authors to get permission to convert these tutorials HERE for HL2 as the archicture tutorials are expert tutorials on creating professionally done maps. --BLacKcHeeTaH

go to http://www.sourcemapping.org/contact to contact me.


Blah

Personally, I think multiple languages all put together in 1 wiki is cluttersome —Ts2do 13:01, 18 Sep 2005 (PDT)

On the subject, is it just me or does this category seem quite cluttered and unorganised? `zozart .chat @ 01:57, 21 Jan 2006 (PST)

Personally, I think the whole Source doc category system is messy. All those headings, followed by a huge lump of category articles. There needs to be a series of concise tutorials in the category 'article' space, not a list of everything! --TomEdwards 03:17, 21 Jan 2006 (PST)
See User:TomEdwards/sandbox --TomEdwards 07:09, 21 Jan 2006 (PST)
I like the idea of two columns. See User:Zozart/category_test `zozart .chat @ 09:05, 21 Jan 2006 (PST)

akilling.org links

Well, they are obviously dead since akilling.org has been shutting down. :(

There is a mirror here: http://www.gmodcentral.com/mirror/akg/index.htm I don't really know what gmodcentral.com is, judging from the forums they try to finance the server via donations. That raises questions how long this site will be online... and they don't host the sample maps.

Now, we can replace all the links to that mirror, wait/make a better mirror, or maybe we could convert the tuts to the wiki... User:Mark_WiseCarver did allow others to mirror the site etc and has also contributed to the wiki, I think he won't have any objections.

Thoughts? --Vaarscha 23:36, 5 Apr 2006 (PDT)

He won't have any objections because he left...—ts2do 23:49, 5 Apr 2006 (PDT)
I know... but I was thinking of answering any copyright questions before they pop up. --Vaarscha 23:51, 5 Apr 2006 (PDT)
Nah...he does (did) it for the community: it seems leaving places for him is a recurring thing [1]—ts2do 23:53, 5 Apr 2006 (PDT)
At the hlmappers maillist I mentioned a temporary url for the akg forums.. http://66.191.215.182/ . Now I was looking at that url again and saw that they moved it ( the forums only ) to http://sourcemapping.org/forum/login.asp?target=default.asp --Jurgen Knops 03:50, 6 Apr 2006 (PDT)
All the tuts seem to be up at http://www.sourcemapping.org/tuts , so perhaps just point the links to there instead... - RodeoClown 16:29, 23 Apr 2006 (PDT)
GMODCENTRAL's game servers are helped by donations, but the website will be up until we decide we don't want it to be. Our initial contract is one year. So don't expect any changes before then. --Eraser 18:47, 11 Apr 2006 (PDT)

Could someone please answer/discuss the main issue here: what to do with the broken links? --Vaarscha 12:49, 6 Apr 2006 (PDT)

I'm not hugely familiar with AKG or its history. My first reaction though would be: If you can contact the articles' authors and get permission, put them directly on here. If not, link to mirrors. If there are no mirrors, delete the links. --Giles 02:02, 11 May 2006 (PDT)
As said above, I think that there's no legal issue if we post his tutorials here. But there are some other problems: 1. overlaps with existing articles 2. tuts depend on example maps (not hosted here) 3. style is different from the usual wiki articles.
If we can find solutions to the problems I'd have no problem with adding the tutorials here (including working on it). Otherwise, we should link to one of the mirrors. Which one is a decision I will not make on my own, we should finally find a consent. --Vaarscha 07:05, 11 May 2006 (PDT)
I sent all of the files to Joe, owner of the sourcemapping.org site.
Don't know if that server will be able to support the bandwidth needed but the files are on-line now.
We have been talking about my possibly creating a new site with Video Tutorials, primarily.
I'm really sorry if I've caused any inconvenience by taking akilling.org down. --wisemx 14:25, 11 May 2006 (PDT)
Forgot to post the new server --wisemx 16:15, 15 Aug 2006 (PDT)

hey i need some help with lighting can anybody help?

Im new to game desionging so i not that good with lighting yet but ive put a couple ligts in a hallway and stairway. they light of the floor but not the celling. also i seem to have a problem getting the sun entity into the sky. it stays horizontal to the player and when im on a hiogher elvation the sun follows me.

Need help thanks.

You have to set the sun entity's angle to a different one...that changes the infinite projection location of it.. for the lights, which material are you using for the ceiling? it may be because the material is made for models or is set to the unlit shader.—ts2do 20:36, 29 Apr 2006 (PDT)

Seriuos help

Okay so i have a bad problem. Hammer keeps giving me errers and and its really slowed down my Mod. The first error is "Windows specified the error" cannot find file specifeid. What the heck that doesnt make any sense and i alreayd tried steams help and support. cant find the dang ask a qustion tab anyware. and tyhen when i compile my map Hl2 starts up normaly then the consle pops up and it loads my map but then the screen keeps flickering like its changing resolutions or someting. then an error window pops up and it says HL2.exe encountered a problem and needs to shutoff. The file is datacahe.dll and accompat.txt in my temp folder. this sucks i need major help. it be greatly aprricated if someone can help with this or leats tell me how to fix it. I can still add brushs and the whole bit. but when it trys to compile it says file not found. and its the only file on my second hardrive so thata why it doesnt make any sense.

Thanks


someone should really help him is anyone going to? (I am new go modding too sry) True_Unity 14:55, 15 Aug 2006 (PDT)

Outer Space??

Hello, I have been tearing at HL2 SDK for a while now trying to get a MOD to go into outer space. I've done many things just short of completely breaking steam :P "sv_gravity 0" gives the no gravity affect, but you cant move. My guess is it's extremely simple or extremely hard. either way I desire to see HL2 in space! Anyone out there have a strategy or tutorial for making a space age level?

Sir_BigOne 7:47pm, 24 March 2007 (PST)


Have you tryed the mod ESMOD or in other words the Enternal silence mod? try that one as it is all SPACE!!!!--Gear 18:11, 4 Apr 2007 (PDT)

Help with options setup for Gmod.

Hi. I was wondering if anyone would help me out with how to set up the options parameters for Gmod 10. I've lightly mapped for CS:S, and would just like to know what to put in all those darned boxes you gotta fill out. (In Hammer, Tools > Options > it brings up Configure Hammer.) I have no idea what folders and all I need to add, put in, enter, etc... Please help, or send an E-Mail to ( xxdeiblerxx@yahoo.com )

thank ya.


Large Edit

Well i edited the area a bit more and organized everything alot better hopefully to all of your eyes along side mine, so tell me what you guys think. Mainly i tried to simplify everything as much as i could. The goal truly is when a new person wants to map, everything here should be easy to find and right away let that person know where it might be under or categorized next to. Mainly when anyone new comes along they might say "well hey i wanna light things up!" So they see that there is a lighting section and viola! They see and find exactly what they where looking for.--Gear 03:25, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)

I have two objections: How does (the obscurely titled) "Creating a Level", which seem to handle the file management of a mod, fit into the Architecture category? Also, "Creating Holes in Displacements" is more of a subfield to "Displacements", and it's linked from that page too. --Andreasen 04:25, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)
Yeah thats what i was thinking yet you can place those where be for now. Ill find a good place for "Creating a Level" as for that "holes in displacements" ill get rid of that, but yup agree with you all the way.--Gear 04:37, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)
Your edits are too numerous for me to keep track of, but I have some more pointers:
  • If possible, an order according to work flow or relevance is often better than an alphabetized order.
  • There is already a link to Nodegraph. (Last time I checked, there are two now, the other one being called "Nodegraph Creation".)
  • I'm not sure that "editable" is a word. It could just say "Source games".
--Andreasen 04:53, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)
The page HDR links to everything within your "LDR and HDR" category except Phong, and the page Lighting links to everything withing your "Lighting category" except Lightmap. Just linking to HDR and Lighting, and adding links to Phong and Lightmap to these pages respectively, will create a shorter and easy-to-browse list. Linking to HDR from Lighting will also trim down the list further. By the way, I don't know that much about Phong, but I don't believe that it has anything to do with HDR. It's more of a shading effect. --Andreasen 06:21, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)

Alrighty and thanks for the feedback, ill get on it right away!--Gear 06:31, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)


Also as to the lighting, I understand that it would be more simple but just wanted to keep these links here for right now. Either way you'll have to reload the previous page or just hit the back button. For right now they will stay but if many others find it annoying then yeah ill take em out.

Reverted

I've reverted these changes. This layout increased the size and complexity of the page by a large amount instead of serving the stated goal of simplifying it. If anything, the page should get smaller, not larger. Also, any large changes to high-traffic pages like this should not be made without previous discussion on the talk page. When you are proposing large design changes, you can create prototype versions of the pages in your own userspace (i.e. User:MrTwoVideoCards/Level Design category layout) if necessary. The previous version is still available in the revision history. --JeffLane 09:56, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)

Isn't it sort of unfair to do that, i belive that we should let others speak for themselves rather than just you Jeff, i understand where you are coming from but just you do not agree with it doesn't mean everyone will hate it.--Gear 10:07, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)

As moderators on this site, we have a responsibility to retain a certain level of quality of our official documentation. Any large changes to high-traffic pages like this should not be made without previous discussion on the talk page. That allows for fair feedback on the proposed changes before they are made. --JeffLane 10:39, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)
I should point out, I mean feedback by anyone who wishes to give it, not just one of the moderators. --JeffLane 10:41, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)
I agree with Jeff here. The Level Design page should, in my opinion, be shrunk even further. I don't currently have the time (AGDC is this week) but I will aim to put up some prototypes of how the page could be decreased further in size, especially in length. We can then discuss them further before making major changes to the page. --Kal Esh 12:53, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)

Proposed Changes

Okay... I liked the way Gear had gone as far as categorizing everything, but the amount of info presented to the user was vast and harder to digest than what was previously there (hence the revert by Jeff). Ignoring any conflict regarding said revert my proposed changes are twofold:

  • Goal #1: Streamline the Level Design page. Present high-level information that makes quick and easy sense (categories).
    • A location to ALL the information (more along the likes of Gear's changes)
    • Game Independent Information
      • e.g. Beginner, Intermediate, Advanced, Compilation theory, etc.
    • Game Dependant Information
      • e.g. Half-Life 2, HL2: Episode One, Counter-Strike: Source, Day of Defeat: Source, The Ship, etc. (HL2: Episode one could even be a sub-link to HL2 due to dependency issues)
      • links to pages providing more in-depth discussion regarding topics specific to those games
      • i.e. Gear's Source Games Category, but changed


  • Goal #2: Support Goal #1 by creating article pages for each high-level link.

This may involve creating mini Level Design pages for each Game, which may be bothersome to setup, but ultimately allow for easier searching of topic or game-specific information

This also includes creating an organizational page (of sorts) for each category of information. For instance, the "Abstract Mapping" article page currently includes a near or exact copy / paste of the list of abstract mapping articles linked through the main Level Design page. The Abstract Mapping article page could instead provide the same list but with short descriptions for each article or set of articles. In addition related articles could be grouped together and the page could be categorized to further help the user.

This same setup could also be applied to article pages for Beginning, Intermediate, and Advanced level design sections. Some of these pages could also have repeating information, which would be okay. Or if too much information is repeating, then traffic could be redirected to locations which contain that information. For example, HL2: Episode One relies on everything from HL2. So, the sub-level design page for HL2: Episode One could contain all the information on the HL2 page plus any additional information specific to Episode One, or it could contain only the information specific to Episode One (HDR for example) and any other information from HL2 could be referred to via a link to the HL2 page.


If, in all my use of this wiki, there has been one thing as a Level Designer / Artist that has rubbed me the wrong way it has been not being able to find the information that I've needed, when I've needed to find it. There is a lot of good information here, but a lot of it is buried. Hopefully, providing a more-robust look at the underlying information available by documenting the types of information available and categorizing it properly will help people find the information they want faster.

What do you think? --Kal Esh 13:47, 4 Sep 2007 (PDT)

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